Posted by Helen on: 03.24.2007 /
Jim interviewed Eliza today at the Off The Map conference, Inside the Missional Matrix. The podcast of the interview is here:
Interview with a missional minded atheist.
In the interview, Jim talked to Eliza about her experience taking a Lutheran class. You can find Eliza’s detailed reports on that class here:
Benjamin and Megan Ady attended the conference. Megan has shared her reflections about it over on our Church Rater blog.
Comment by: Tamara
1The blogosphere is a wonderful and peculiar phenomenon. I, too, attended this conference. When Jim announced on Friday PM that he would be interviewing an atheist on Saturday about her experience attending a church class, I immediately knew he was talking about Eliza (because I had followed all her posts). I thought, “Wow, another blog ‘character’ is going to materialize before my eyes!”
Eliza’s comments were insightful and thought-provoking. I’m glad she dropped in. I don’t know if I would have had the tenacity she did to keep going back - and I believe all this stuff! :)
Comment by: Helen
2Hi Tamara, I’m glad you were able to hear Eliza in person yesterday.
As you might have seen from the comments on Eliza’s posts, we were all very impressed by her tenacity also!
Comment by: benjamin ady
3Hey Tamara! It was nice to meet you yesterday.
I thought Eliza was brilliant. I loved it when she said
That’s my paraphrase, but I think it fairly gets at what Eliza was saying. I think that accurately represents a huge swath of people–we postmoderns, as it were. Systematic theology is totally … unengaging to us. that is, BORING!. I don’t want to know what you believe. I want to know *how* you came to believe it, and with whom, and … what are you afraid of, and when did you feel ashamed, and what was it like when god spoke to you, and how do you interact with time, and ….
in other words, tell me a story. NOT a metanarrative–a specific narrative about you! Your specific narrative is fascinating, but your attempts at metanarrative are …. generally poorly conceived and worsely executed.
anyway, I’m not saying Eliza was saying all that. but she very much somehow summed all that up for me in one rather brief and brilliant observation. Thankyou Eliza!
Comment by: Tamara
4Hi Ben. Yes, that statement by Eliza stuck with me too. You paraphrased it well. A related discussion that came up a couple of times is this myth that we as Christians are supposed to have all the answers, like the pastor did in Eliza’s class.
Yet, in my experience, having all the answers lends itself to shutting down the conversation sometimes. For example, if I’m talking to someone who seems to have an answer for everything - regardless of the subject matter - I tend to quit engaging after awhile. Can I learn something from this person? Absolutely. But if they have all the answers, I wonder if they have stopped learning and growing themselves (which is sad).
As you said, Ben, it’s not always about the “what.” Sometimes it’s more about the “why” and the “how.” One thing you (and Meg) wrote in the other conference thread about Todd and Scot was that these very educated men did not pretend to have all the answers. That’s what made them more “real” to me.
Comment by: Helen
5Benjamin, that’s what I loved about the lectures by NT Wright I heard on Friday - I knew they were going to be about theology and wondered if I’d be bored. Instead, to my surprise, I found myself listening to a beautiful story.
Actually I suppose it was a metanarrative - but I enjoyed it anyway.
Comment by: benjamin ady
6Helen,
Yeah–some people *can* pull off metanarrative. But … most people can’t. And they don’t *need* to–their own narrative is automatically inherently fascinating.
Comment by: Eliza
7Thanks for posting the podcast, Helen! I haven’t listened to it, but since I was at the interview I think I remember how it mostly went. ;-)
Jim was great - he was welcoming, asked good questions, and made it a safe environment for me to answer & share my thoughts.
It was also neat just to be at the conference for a few hours - Scot McKnight gave a really interesting half hour talk, and I got to see Meg again & meet Benjamin for the first time. The conference attendees seemed like really down-to-earth, kind people. (It helped that many of them nodded and smiled during the interview!) I got to glance over at Meg and Benjamin from time to time, as my anchors in the audience - that was helpful!
It was especially nice to talk with Meg, Benjamin, and Scot (and a few others who came and went in the conversation) after the interview, about all kinds of belief- and practice-related stuff.
All in all, a very positive experience, for me. Again - thanks, Jim!
Comment by: Helen
8Eliza, yes, you probably don’t need to listen to the podcast ;-)
One of my favorite parts was where you said “Fifteen classes, Jim” when he said a slightly lower number.
I’m glad you enjoyed the experience. Jim is awesome at making it safe when he interviews people who aren’t Christians.
I liked Scot’s talk too - I listened to the podcast - that was the “Mistakes Christians make” one, I think, where the first mistake was, they try to make people feel bad (about sin) instead of simply casting a vision of Jesus?
He liked your interview - from his blog:
I was delighted to meet Benjamin and Meg in person at the November conference - that conference wouldn’t have been so much fun for me if they hadn’t been there.
Comment by: Rachel
9Helen, I tried several times to listen to Eliza’s interview but the podcast only lasts about 2 seconds and consists of about half a sentence by Jim.
Comment by: Helen
10Rachel, I don’t know why that is happening - sorry - but you could try right-clicking it to download it to your computer, then listen to the downloaded copy. Sometimes it works better when it doesn’t have to go through your internet connection. I downloaded them all first then listened.
Comment by: Rachel
11Thanks, Helen - I did it that way and it worked correctly.
I really enjoyed the interview! I was so fun to finally hear Eliza’s voice. And I also heard Benjamin’s famous laugh in the background. :-)
Comment by: Helen
12Hi Rachel, I’m glad it worked! Yes, I really enjoyed the interview too. I thought it went very well.
Comment by: Eliza
13First time in a while I’ve been called young! Thanks, Scot - I’ll take it - it may be the last time!