Posted by Helen on: 09.26.2007 /
I’m also posting this on Friendly Christian today
What would it be like to be an atheist at a Christian college? If you want to know, read the blog Leaving Eden. The author of it is at Wheaton College and is an atheist.
Last week it felt very lonely:
I walked across campus today after a conversation that signaled the end of another friendship. Thinking, this is what it feels like to be alone. It sucks.
If Jesus was the friend of non-religious people, shouldn’t Christians be too? Why does admitting to being an atheist end this person’s friendships with Christians?
Comment by: joe
1 09/26/07 6:26 AM | Comment Link |Numerous possibilities. Probably most likely is that young christians attending Wheaton College are arrogant and defensive, so perhaps see someone who remains an atheist in that environment as a bit of a threat.
But then, I’m not convinced of the value of Christian colleges. We don’t really have them in the UK.
Comment by: Stephan
2 09/26/07 7:21 AM | Comment Link |This leaves me with several observations and questions.
If the writer is still “in the closet” as an atheist, why do they think they are being rejected because they are an atheist? Maybe they’re just not very likable.
Also, I think being lonely on a college campus is not isolated (no pun intended) to atheists. I think many people have that experience, whether or not they really fit in. I think very popular people (not that I ever was one) probably feel isolated at times.
As far as not being involved on campus, I was a Christian at a Christian college and was not very involved on campus, but I was not rejected. I found the praise and worship services to be shallow and pretentious, and I was not involved in any Bible studies. But I had friends anyway.
I feel for this student, but I would assert that their isolation may be more self induced than anything else.
Comment by: Doreen
3 09/26/07 7:36 AM | Comment Link |Christians cannot understand why an atheist would be at a Christian college. Moreover, if you’re at a mainstream Protestant college like I am, they cannot understand why Catholics, UUs, Wiccans, or atheists would be there.
When a member of my newly formed covenant discipleship group found out I was not a Christian, she went to the professor and asked to be put in another group. She was not.
This semester I’m really causing a to-do because I’m taking a consortium class at THE most conservative seminary in the consortium. They not only do not believe women should preach, they won’t even let women enroll in preaching classes. Why, you ask?
:)
Comment by: Stephan
4 09/26/07 8:02 AM | Comment Link |Doreen, based on what I have read from you I would call you a Christian. You are certainly not traditional, but you seem to believe in and follow Jesus. That, to me, is a Christian.
I truly don’t understand why an atheist would go to Wheaton, unless it is to prove that an atheist can’t fit in at Wheaton. And if you go there trying to prove that, chances are you will.
Comment by: Julie Clawson
5 09/26/07 8:02 AM | Comment Link |Interesting. When I was there only Christians were allowed to attend. You had to sign a statement of faith and confirm that you were a believer (I guess you could lie). One could stay at the school if one lost one’s faith while there, which was not an uncommon circumstance (at least among the intellectual liberal arts students I hung out with).
and yes, students at a college like Wheaton are very arrogant and defensive - at least as freshmen. it doesn’t surprise me (although it is sad) that people there are not accepting. It might help to know that (at least when I was there) there was a support group for “unbelievers” led by Dr. Jay Wood of the philosophy department.
Comment by: Stephan
6 09/26/07 8:18 AM | Comment Link |I read a little more at leavingeden and found that this student was a Christian when they started to attend and lost their faith. At that point I can understand staying. Transferring to another college when you’re almost done would be difficult, but maybe not more difficult than what they are currently going through.
The college I went to makes Wheaton look like Sodom. Smugness does not even begin to describe the atmosphere, although it has lightened up some since I graduated 17 years ago.
Comment by: David H
7 09/26/07 9:21 AM | Comment Link |I went to Messiah College — formerly Brethren in Christ school, now just a general Christian liberal arts college — and heard frequently from other students that Wheaton barely qualified (in the spiritual sense) to be in the same league as Messiah. Plenty of my classmates thought half the people at Wheaton were atheists.
The funny thing about Messiah was that lots of kids there were not at a Christian school by their choice. Mom and Dad thought they needed a Christian school with the rules and structure that went with that. So they spent a good deal of their time rebelling against those restrictions. But if faced with something that seemed to challenge Christianity — which they normally seemed to see as simply a straight-jacket — then suddenly these kids were all rallying around the Christian flag. I took a class on comparative religions in which the professor made us each adopt a religion other than Christianity and write a paper justifying our adopted faith. Almost the entire class went to the Dead of students and asked that she be terminated because she couldn’t be a Christian if she asked them to do such a thing. Tolerance for alternative points of view was not much in evidence when I attended Messiah. A young lady from my church recently transferred out of Messiah because she found few who had any real depth of faith, but plenty who resisted any attempts to make them look beyond their own narrow borders.
Comment by: Karen
8 09/26/07 10:49 AM | Comment Link |Okay, is there such a thing as a Freudian typo? :-)
I feel really sorry for the closeted student. It’s rather isolating being an atheist in the U.S. anyway, but at least in the adult world you can choose to hang out with people who are as tolerant as possible.
It sounds to me like s/he is slowly “coming out” to selected friends and being rejected by all or most of them. :-( I suppose s/he has to be careful about who to talk to, for fear of reprisals if there’s a commitment statement s/he might now be violating.
All I can say is that I hope the academic year speeds by quickly! Oh, and thank science for the Internet. :-)
Comment by: leavingeden
9 09/26/07 11:05 AM | Comment Link |Hi all, I’m the leavingeden blogger.
Some clarification: I did become an atheist at Wheaton, and there’s not much possibility of transferring– there are other reasons for that which are not really suitable for discussing on the blog. I’m not “out” in general, but there are a few people who know or suspect the truth– Karen, you hit it right on.
David, it seems like that attitude at Messiah (we are “more Christian” than other schools) is common to many Christian colleges– at least, I hear it from friends at other Christian colleges. Actually, there seems to be a lot of this kind of finger-pointing among evangelicals in general.
Julie, a support group for unbelievers? That sounds amazing and wholly un-Wheaton-like. I’ve never even heard a whisper of such an idea.
Comment by: joe
10 09/26/07 11:20 AM | Comment Link |Aggg… that just sucks.
I commit here and now that if there is any school or college or university that requires a faith or commitment statement of that kind from me or my child, then that is not an institution I will have anything to do with. Humph, I’ve not been so angry in a very long time.
Comment by: David H
11 09/26/07 11:21 AM | Comment Link |I was always amazed at the holier-than-thou attitude I heard coming from people I knew were spending much time living a very “unholy” lifestyle when no one was watching. Behind the scenes activities at Messiah (students frolicking in the dorms, etc.) was very similar to what my friends at Penn State were doing. However, no one at the state school was pretending they were doing anything else.
A friend of mine from high school is now (still?) a professor at Wheaton: Lynn Cohick. She has bucked some conservative Christian attitudes by going to seminary and being ordained despite being a woman. My guess is she wouldn’t be as closed as some of the students there.
Comment by: joe
12 09/26/07 11:22 AM | Comment Link |PS, this might be of use?
Comment by: Stephan
13 09/26/07 11:30 AM | Comment Link |I have a cousin who graduated from Wheaton who is now a registered Democrat. Oh, horror! He is a history professor up the road at North Park, where they are a little more open minded about that sort of thing.
I went to Northwestern College in St. Paul, MN. I don’t have any hard feelings toward the school, but I probably would not encourage my kids to go there. Several of my friends from college have moved significantly to the left politically, ideologically and theologically since then, at least in part due to the lack of diversity of opinion presented there.
Comment by: Helen
14 09/26/07 11:44 AM | Comment Link |Hi leavingeven, thanks for stopping by. I hope you find a way to connect with people who want to be friends with you, whether they’re Christians, atheists, or something else.
Comment by: Friendly Atheist » Atheist at Wheaton College
15 09/26/07 6:19 PM | Comment Link |[...] Conversation at the Edge) Technorati Tags: atheist, atheism, Christian, Jesus, God, religion Share This Popularity: 1% [...]
Comment by: g-love
16 09/27/07 12:34 PM | Comment Link |tsk tsk tsk, don’t they know the commandment Thou shalt not frolick? :)
Comment by: Staci
17 09/27/07 4:03 PM | Comment Link |I spent my first 2 yrs. of college at a private christian college, and then transferred to finish my degree at a small, regional state college. I now work at a state university - the largest in our state. In my experience arrogance, defensiveness, loneliness, and frolicking abound in all. As do passion and apathy, kindness and cruelty, support and neglect, etc. Sometimes I think the only way we learn to see the shades of gray (and other colors) is to experience both extremes of black and white up close and in person. IMO these experiences are pretty universal regardless of religious beliefs or lack thereof. The great hope is that somewhere in the “higher education” experience we discover the relationships that matter more than the ideology, the ability to change and grow, the thrill of moving beyond the extremes and into real life. What a terribly wonderful time.
Leavingeden, I hope you can find some of your friends (or perhaps some new ones) with whom you can have both openness and kindness. If you are willing to offer the same, you can usually find at least a couple of very good friends.
Sorry for the general shmoopiness of this post. Sometimes it comes out despite best efforts to be witty or intellectual.
Comment by: Debbie
18 10/7/07 10:20 AM | Comment Link |I have served in Christian ministry for over 20 years and have been a pastor’s wife for nearly 10 of those. I am now separated and awaiting divorce. During my time of healing over the past 2 years of separation, therapy, and abuse at the hands of my so-called “Christian” friends, I found one very special friend. She is an atheist, and a very convicted one. At first meeting, you would have thought a pastor’s wife and an atheist would have little in common. She remains my closest friend, my greatest support, and my most valued support-sister. And it has NOTHING to do with religion - which we agree to disagree on. That doesn’t mean we don’t talk religion - we do. We just don’t try to sell each other anything. We just listen, and support. It’s a beautiful relationship. When I say “praise God,” she smiles for me. When she gets angry and says screw God, I give her a shoulder to rest on.
Just love keeps us connected. Isn’t that what Jesus really asked us to do anyway? He doesn’t need anyone to advertise His name - God, if we think we need to do that for Him we must have a tiny God who is incapable and we myst think very highly of ourselves!
I love my girlfriend. She is an atheist. I am a Christian. We have much to share and offer each other.
Comment by: Helen
19 10/7/07 12:35 PM | Comment Link |Hi Debbie, thanks for posting on CatE! You’re very welcome here.
I appreciate you sharing about your special atheist girlfriend. I’m very happy for you that you have a friend like her to support you through what you’ve been through lately. I’m reposting your comment here since it is a wonderful example of what we believe can happen between Christians and atheists:
Christians and atheists can be special friends